Liver Qi Stagnation and Spleen Deficiency

forum post

Liver Qi Stagnation and Spleen Deficiency

Published on 01-15-2009

"zafarcs" has authored 9 other posts.


I am able to find a acupuncturist here in Dubai. They diagnose me with Spleen Qi Deficiency and Liver Qi Stagnation . They did acupuncture me on these points gb1,gb15,gb13,st6,kd5,li4,ht7. With tongue is light red and sides of the toungue is curvy. Do you think is it the right choice of points.

Secondly, should i go for herbs also with it? what kind of herbs should i go for. I am using chamomile herb, is this suitable with my diagnosis.

Symptoms are :

Facial Stiffness, Heaviness in the chest, Nervousness, Anxiety, Stiffness in the Jaws,lethargic.

And what could be the suitable choice of points for acupressure for me. I have been doing acupressure for almost 1 year but now able to find the diagnosis.

This post has the following associations:

Acupoints: gv 20, gv 26, ht 7, ht 8, pc 6, pc 7, pc 8, st 5, st 6, st 7, st 36

Below are the most recent, view all here.

Comments / Discussions:

As I'm sure you understand, it would be inappropriate for me to comment on another doctors point prescription and diagnosis for a patient that I have never seen. WIthout knowledge of your full medical history and seeing you in person all I can add is general information. The points listed seem reasonable as does your diagnosis. If you do not get results after 6-10 treatments, then it might be appropriate for me to add more, but for now you should trust your practitioner and what they recommend for you.

To further educate yourself you could read the following basic diagnostic sections (with treatment points):

Spleen Qi Deficiency

Liver Qi Stagnation

As for the tea, yes, Chamomile is an excellent mild choice. If you need something stronger you could experiment with Valerian Root tea as well.

With regards to acupressure points to use, LV 3 and SP 6 would be appropriate, also whichever of the following feels helpful to you - PC 6, PC 7, PC 8, HT 7, HT 8.

Posted: 01-16-2009

Yah the points are helping me but i have bought a package of only five treatments and cannot go any further, the good thing about Acupuncture is it is extremely powerful and helpful but it is too expensive in most parts of the world.

I am using your suggested points for acupressure and they are helpful, the one thing, that is probabily associated with spleen deficiency, when i get up in the morning i am very stiff, heavy eyes, tired, drowsy, not really feeling like doing anythig, stiff jaws, but it gets better after 4 ,5 hours but then half of the day is over, can you please guide me with it like, can i do something before going to bad or just after getting up, some kind of massage, some exercise that help me getup fresh and alert.

And tiredness accompanied with heavy face, that is more irritating than anything else, can i do some kind of face massage, i do shaol lin temple massage but it is not that helpful to my facial stiffnenss, or some face points that can help me relax my face. I had a critical head surgery at my early age, my acupuncturist says that stiffness may be the result of that surgery. I can manage it if do some points in the morning or before going to bed that help me relax my face.


Posted: 01-17-2009

Acupressure points that may be helpful would be pressure and/or tapping on GV 20 and GV 26 (fairly strong). And if your jaw is stiff you could massage along the ST 5, ST 6, and ST 7 area. If you can obtain it, moxibustion would be most helpful on ST 36. This can be done as a home treatment and you can purchase the moxa sticks online at many retailers - they are relatively inexpensive. See my article - "What Is Moxibustion, and other techniques "acupuncturists" use" for more information.

Posted: 01-17-2009

I have done with 5 acupuncture treatments now. First three treatments were the same points as i mentioned above then in the 4th session she left li4 and added sp6 and sp3 point and in the last session she used lv3,li4,st36,kd3 and the point in between the eye brows. The overall effects are good, feeling better, i can see my tongues health a lot better.

The problem is i still feel that uncomfortable feeling in the chest that is upper part of the chest she did niddle that area of the chest but the feeling is still there. This feeling does go away by the acupressure, but come back immediately after taking some sweet foods, soft drinks, pizza, fast food (Lots of foods create this problem) . I try to avoid these foods as much i can. How should i manage this, the feeling is like sometimes heaviness, sometimes shakiness in the chest. What i am thinking is, just do acupressure and avoid those foods for 6 months and see how it effects me. Or is there any other way dealing with this. I try to desolve these feelings through imagination and visualization, they go away for a little while and come back again. These feelings can be termed as Depression + Panic and all in the upper chest.

What can i do in a long run to help myself, one thing i can understand is if i go for acupuncutre now, it will be like a hit and try thing and will take too long and i will have to find some more experienced acupunturist then what i have found now who can think above stress and pains.

And one more thing, even chomamile tea created problem for me, after taking one cup daily for 3 4 days i start having these uncomfortable feelings in my chest, uncomfortable feelings around my face like stiffness.

What can i do to make the acupressure effects last longer and avoid such kind of food reactions.

Posted: 02-05-2009

My experience is that effect depends on which hand you are using. I am always using steady pressure 5 minutes on each point. I would characterize left hand as having positive polarity (+) and right hand as having negative polarity (-). The choose of (+) and (-) is based solely on my subjective feeling dont know the scientific mechanism behind this but i suppose it is because of magnetic field. I am left handed, maybe right handed have opposite polarities in each hand.

Posted: 04-22-2010

You can look if you want for a cupping therapist , there must be one in Dubai

Posted: 06-18-2010

I highly recommend looking for a book by Donna Eden - Energy Medicine. You can also search the web for videos of her doing &#39The Five Minute Routine" to balance your vital energies. From what you describe, with spleen deficiency and jaw tightness, there seems to be stress involved. Her book describes the relationship of Triple Warmer (TW) (sometimes called triple heater) and Spleen meridians. Stress results with TW overenergized. The first place TW gets extra energy is from Spleen. There are many qigong exercises to reduce this effect, some of which are quite simple. A good one is "smooth behind the ears." Starting at the temple, trace around your ear, thruogh the back of your neck, and then pull through your shoulders (which are probably tight). This is essentially sedating TW meridian. Another nice one, called Spleen Hug, is to wrap your right hand around and place it over your spleen. Wrap your left hand to hold your right elbow (on the path of the TW meridian). A combination of these and the daily routine should help you to feel better and make a good compliment to acupuncture/acupressure.

Posted: 06-24-2010

Hello Zafarcs,

Your chest symptoms, the heaviness after acidic foods, wine and coffee look like the annoying stomach ulcer I had. I had it for years on and off, but I treated it finally with Oil of Oregano to kill the bacteria H. Pylori.

I took 4 drops of oil in a glass of water twice a day for 3 days and it was gone.

I would take yogurt and green powders and FOS after that to recover my intestinal flora. Mastic gum also kills h. Pylori, according to a scientific study published in the Lancet. A man I know had a really bad bleeding ulcer that no antibiotics could help and he cured himself with mastic gum. I would not take antibs - some can mess up your kidneys and are not always helpful with H. Pylori.

P.S. . The sun is very strong in Dubai and if you cover yourself completly to protect from the burning sun, you may be lacking in vitamin D and calcium. Vitamin D is very important beyond calcium -- much research on D is coming out right now about the immune system and D. Spleen is an important part of the immune system.

I wish you best health, regards,


Posted: 08-12-2010

Hello Blade,

Thank you for the recommandation. I need to find this Kombucha. Is Egyptian licorice different than American licorice or it&#39s because Zafarcs is in Dubai and this is what he can find?

Posted: 08-19-2010

you have several symptoms, but the main symptom is facial and jaw stiffness, it means you have very slightly wind stroke symptoms, the wind stroke have 2 kinds, one the outside wind, the other is inside wind, the outside wind is easy to treat by acupunture or tuina, the inside wind is your some small blood vessals been blocked, so it need herb formula to sooth your blood circle system, please check your blood and blood pressure first, then we can find it out.

Posted: 08-20-2010

I am a long time fan of herbal teas and I would also recommend drinking Egyptian Licorice tea, it also helps killing the harmful bacterias that cause intestinal ulcers as well as it helps strengtening the intestinal walls. The tea is sweet tasting therefore it is good tasting and even those not too fund of the taste of some of the herb teas find it good. It was also one of the favorites of the pharaos of ancient Egypt.

For rebuilding the intestinal flora I would more recommend the Kombucha tea, this has a higher dose of bacteria cultures than yoghurts do, and also assist the spleen and cleans the liver at the same time. This tea however has a strong sweet-and-sour taste to it that some people not too found of.


Posted: 08-20-2010

Honestly Elena I never researched the difference between the American and the Egyptian licorice, I simply purchase the Egyptian kind because the supplier I get a discount from only sells this one.

If you start drinking the kombucha tea, a quick advice for you: do it gradually, do not drink more than one cup/day for at least a week - perhaps two weeks when you start out. This tea is strong and the body needs to adjust to it gradually. Even after the one or two weeks it is recommended that you drink no more than two-three cups at the most a day but when you do, your digestion will go through some major changes, mine improved a lot - of course I have been consuming it for about two years now.

Let me know if you have any more questions on this.


Posted: 08-25-2010

For facial Stiffness: do facial local points St4 to St6, and St6 to St4, St5, St7 and St3, for heaviness in the chest: Ren17, for nervousness and Anxiety : YinTang and ear shenmen, for Liver Qi Stag. add Li4 & Lv3, for lethargic : K3, 6. for Sp Qi def. : Sp10, St36 and Ren12.

Posted: 11-15-2010

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